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'Pyes Hall' Path Closure - Change of Plan?
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Author:  Derick Evans [ Mon Mar 11, 2013 1:37 am ]
Post subject:  'Pyes Hall' Path Closure - Change of Plan?
I read with great interest the threads in 2012, regarding the new development at Donna Nook and in particular the possibility that the coastal path may end at a proposed breach in the sea wall.
I was aware that there was local opposition to the breach, including the District Council. Also that many LBC members and even none Linc's based birders were less than happy about some aspects of the project and keen to see a new path around the bund, in the event that the coastal path did end at that proposed breach in the sea wall. If a type of sluice was the preferred option then a circular route was the preferred option also talked about.

Having not heard any news since 2012, I wondered what decisions if any had been made on the proposed breach/sluice and or the path issue!

With these thoughts very much is in my mind while visiting the Donna Nook area. I met and spoke with an EA Rep. in the car park.
When I asked about the project and the possibility of a change of plan, incorporating possibly a new path/circular route he said very little. :o
Other than the plans had changed regarding the proposals for the removal of the old sea wall.
I was given no direct reason why EA were re-thinking the breach idea but was told there had been no final decision made yet and I was advised to ask these question directly to EA, if I/we were concerned about the project and direction of any new footpath.

So I did just that. (See EA reply below)

NB: The Environment Agency are obviously re-thinking this whole project right now and in particular, the sea wall breach. I believe a new path is now a distinct possibility if the breach idea is dropped, which I understand appears very likely but will enough people take the time to make their feelings known. :roll:

So how about it folks. :wink: Email - alison.treverton@environment-agency.gov.uk

Reply from EA.

Dear Derick
Thank you very much for your enquiry.
As you may be aware, our application to ‘stop-up’ the existing footpath at Donna Nook was refused by East Lindsey District Council last year. We are currently exploring our next steps so no decision has yet been taken on how the sea will enter the site, however we are committed to developing intertidal habitat at the site.

Our intention was to provide a footpath on the new embankment and the existing footpath would be accessible up to the breach site but there would be no way of getting across the breach. We are looking at our plans as we explore the next steps outlined above.

If you have any further questions, then please do not hesitate to contact me.

Regards
Alison

Alison Treverton - Corporate Services Team Leader
Email - alison.treverton@environment-agency.gov.uk

Environment Agency - Waterside House, Waterside North, Lincoln, LN2 5HA
Author:  Phil Espin [ Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 'Pyes Hall' Path Closure - Change of Plan?
Valiant attempt Derick but the EA reply reminds me of what I used to say to my kids when they ounged for stuff: "we'll see".
Author:  Derick Evans [ Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 'Pyes Hall' Path Closure - Change of Plan?
Hi Phil.
Hope your wrong mate but I know what you mean.
The EA are bound by the freedom of information act. So in theory must give honest answers, just need to ask the right questions. I have written again to EA, asking for an update on the situation.

A councillor friend of mine has a favourite saying. "Remember - Pressure not points win prizes" :wink:

I see no harm, only good if LBC and or it's members voiced their opinion on the issues of pathways and viewing the site at least. I understand that 'East Lindsey District Council' are unlikely to change their mind on thier objections to the breach, unless persuaded otherwise.

So better we ask sooner than too late!
Author:  Derick Evans [ Mon Mar 11, 2013 10:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 'Pyes Hall' Path Closure - Change of Plan?
Derick Evans wrote:
Hi Phil. <snip>
The EA are bound by the freedom of information act. <snip>
I understand that 'East Lindsey District Council' are unlikely to change their mind on thier objections to the breach. <snip> !


My apologies. I really cant believe I even thought, let alone typed those words.

Has anyone else taken the time to read through the minutes of the ELDC meeting on 10/03/11 and the associated realignments schemes planning application appeal notes? (Written on pink paper :shock: due to it's sensitivity)

I may be wrong. Again! but it seems that the issues surrounding this project stem from the fact that ELDC did not have a crystal ball. :wink:
Author:  Derick Evans [ Fri Mar 15, 2013 1:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 'Pyes Hall' Path Closure - Change of Plan?
Hope were not missing an opportunity to influence the outcome of EA's re-think on this important project.

Spending a few minutes sending that email and supporting North Somercotes PC, who have objected to the proposed footpath closure from the start. Could make all the difference.

EA really wanted the breach and might just add that 'Footbridge' to their revised plan, if persuaded by public opinion.
Author:  Geoff Williams [ Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 'Pyes Hall' Path Closure - Change of Plan?
Hi Derick,
I think you may have missed the boat as if you read the ELDC minutes for 22/11/12 you will see the diversion has been approved and so the old footpath is no more, (The new route will become the coastal footpath).
Geoff
Author:  Derick Evans [ Fri Mar 22, 2013 12:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 'Pyes Hall' Path Closure - Change of Plan?
Hi Geoff.
No i haven't read those minutes. So don't doubt what you say.

The only reason I asked for people to email EA was after being informed by EA that.
"Our application to ‘stop-up’ the existing footpath at Donna Nook was refused".
That EA were re-thinking the breach idea but no final decision had been made yet.

I received that info on March 11th 2013 Geoff.
Author:  Geoff Williams [ Fri Mar 22, 2013 8:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 'Pyes Hall' Path Closure - Change of Plan?
Geoff Williams wrote:
Hi Derick,
I think you may have missed the boat as if you read the ELDC minutes for 22/11/12 you will see the diversion has been approved and so the old footpath is no more, (The new route will become the coastal footpath).
Geoff

I think I have misread the minutes and that the stopping up of the old path has not been passed after all, it appears that it referred to a diversion of the new path around a pond that has been agreed.
See http://www.eldc.gov.uk/committee/mgAi.aspx?ID=15037
You can also read other minutes from this link.
The EA have already rejected a bridge and tunnel for the old path and they say if the breech does not go ahead the realignment scheme won't work correctly so it will be interesting to see what happens next.
I have pm'ed Del.
Geoff
Author:  Derick Evans [ Fri Mar 22, 2013 10:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 'Pyes Hall' Path Closure - Change of Plan?
[quote="Geoff Williams"]Hi Derick, I think you may have missed the boat (snip) The EA have already rejected a bridge and tunnel for the old path and they say if the breech does not go ahead the realignment scheme won't work correctly. (snip) [quote]

Thanks for the PM and the info.Geoff.
Pleased to hear there's still room available on the 'email' boat.
Maybe that's the solution Geoff. - A ferry :D

If they can build a major road bridge accross the Humber.
Then one would think the EA could manage a footbridge but we'll see :wink:
Author:  Derick Evans [ Sat Mar 23, 2013 1:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 'Pyes Hall' Path Closure - Change of Plan?
Notes from ELDC planning meetings minutes for 18/10/2012 & 22/11/2012.

18th Oct.Meeting: ELDC Committee agreed to officers taking the application through the formal stages to secure the stopping up and diversion of Public Footpath along the top of the new embankment but that this would not prevent the submission of objections.

22nd Nov. Meeting - ELDC Members objected to the proposed stopping up order and determined that officers should not progress the order relating to it and the creation of a new footpath.

EA's are it seems forced to re-think their plans. Unless they can get ELDC to change their minds about stopping off the old footpath at the breach. They would appear to be snookered.

EA had considered a footbridge over the breach at the planning application stage in order to create a circular walk. (This option was discounted due to technical difficulties) :roll:

Wonder why they didn't consider the possible issues surrounding the stopping of a 'Public footpath' in more depth at the pre-design stage. Before submitting a floored planning application, or at least before doing all the realignment work. [-X
Author:  Phil Espin [ Sat Mar 23, 2013 9:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 'Pyes Hall' Path Closure - Change of Plan?
Hi Derick. I attended the consultation meetings at North Somercotes in 2009 and advocated a footbridge. It is clear they have never seriously considered the bridge idea presumably because of cost. It goes beyond the bridge itself. When they are done the dunes north of Stonebridge car park and the footpaths on and either side of them will not be defended. There is an anticipation that they will wash away as sea levels rise. That will mean that access to a bridge would disappear. The fact that this will probably be at least 50 years away doesn't seem to matter to them.

The piers either side of a bridge would need to be piled because of erosion by tides. That would be expensive too. I also suggested they should put a high spoil tip/ artificial dune in by the breach to provide a panoramic view of the whole area. They didn't like that idea either.

I made all these points in a letter at the planning stage and it made no difference at that point.

As we all live in hope I've banged off an extra email but remain pessimistic.
Author:  Derick Evans [ Sat Mar 23, 2013 3:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 'Pyes Hall' Path Closure - Change of Plan?
Frustrating eh Phil. If you didn't know and had followed this saga. You would be forgiven for asking if any consultation ever took place.

I know that flood defence and habitat/species management is the priority here and rightly so.
Having said that. The inclusion of a footbridge to facilitate both retaining the coastal path and incorporating a circular route around the site, would be a very welcome bonus for the many expected visitors who's taxes will ultimately pay the bill.

The reason EA give for abandoning their own Bridge ideas, was not due to the expence but as you pointed out Phil it was the possiblity of erosion of what EA expected would be a large concrete central pier, needed to support a footbridge over the 40 metre breach.

As times money in the construction game, one would hope they get it sorted sooner than later.
Author:  Phil Espin [ Sat Mar 23, 2013 3:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 'Pyes Hall' Path Closure - Change of Plan?
I also suggested one of those baskets on wire arrangements that you see across rivers in Peru on which you wind yourself across. No joy on that one either, something about health and safety. If people want to risk their scopes surely thats up to them?
Author:  Derick Evans [ Sat Mar 23, 2013 5:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 'Pyes Hall' Path Closure - Change of Plan?
Phil Espin wrote:
I also suggested one of those baskets on wire arrangements that you see across rivers in Peru on which you wind yourself across. No joy on that one either, something about health and safety. If people want to risk their scopes surely thats up to them?


If those baskets are anything like the Dursey Island cable car experience, then you can keep it Phil.

Why the problem? When there appears to be so many cheap and viable alternatives for footbridges available to cross all manner of water bodies. (see below)

My favourite - http://www.farmersbridges.co.uk/photos/bridge017.jpg
http://www.farmersbridges.co.uk/pedestr ... idges.html
http://www.farmersbridges.co.uk/photos/bridge001.jpg
Author:  Andy Sims [ Sat Mar 23, 2013 9:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 'Pyes Hall' Path Closure - Change of Plan?
The Dursey island cable car is great, I really enjoyed it, no cows or sheep in it the day I went across. Alison would not entertain it so I went on my own!
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