The Lincolnshire Bird Club

Graham Catley's photograph of a wing-tagged Marsh Harrier today (6 Sep), proclaiming its 'writ large' identity as 'Number 39', leaves me feeling somewhat uneasy......as I have always felt when I've watched a wing-tagged Red Kite around Rockingham Forest or a tracking-device-fitted White-tailed Eagle in Scotland.

I KNOW these state of the art devices are for monitoring purposes, and I will doubtless be castigated by tracking buffs trying to educate this poor, misguided birder, but isn't it really a step too far in our never-ending search for exactitude in the whereabouts of certain birds.

I consider it a form of enforced disfigurement and, of course, we are informed the bird 'doesn't mind',....and anyway, it's all in the interests of scientific progress. So that's all right then, and how on earth can anyone reliably know that the bird or its mate 'doesn't mind' ? So bird No. 28, No. 280 or, perhaps one day, No. 2800 (as the habit spreads to encompass all large birds, perhaps....and I'd put my money on that assumption rather than 'the bird doesn't mind') was wing-tagged in Leics, visited Notts and Lincs and was found dead in Cambs. Big deal! How remarkable ! We see a 'disfigured' Red Kite in an area where few or even none have been seen before - does it really matter whether the bird is from Wales, Scotland, Rockingham Forest or wherever....despite what the detail-obsessed researcher/scientist tells us. We know it's from somewhere, for heaven's sake.....is the tracker's pin so vital on the map ? Is the all-encompassing 'research' so vital ?

I really look upon these ultra-visible devices as debasing a thing of beauty, as I'm sure many other birders do, with most bird photographers included. To me, looking at such disfigured birds in the wild is rather like watching a Miss World competition where the contestants are forced to wear Wellingtons and Balaclavas (Beauty betrayed and perverted), ......although even that may appeal to some of a certain leaning.

Freddy

Very good point Freddy,

_________________
Regards
Dean Eades



Take nothing but photos - Leave nothing but footprints - Waste nothing but time

My website: http://www.birdmad.com
https://www.facebook.com/dean.eades1
http://www.flickr.com/photos/birdmad/
http://www.lcegroup.co.uk
http://www.Canon.co.uk

A valid argument eloquently put!

David

Freddy,
We have come a long way from believing that Swallows hibernated in mud at the bottom of ponds but there is still very little known about the migration of a large number of species. I'm sure you are aware of this but individual marking of birds often converts conjecture into fact. We still use metal rings to identify individuals but the information gained from this only happens when the individual is re-caught or found dead. Colour ringing (including wing tags and neck collars) evolved from this so that individuals could be positively identified in the field.

We have now moved on with electronic/gps devices fitted to birds to identify their exact movements. Did you know the exact route, duration of migration and eventual destination of species such as Osprey and Cuckoo until this year? I think not.

The RSPB and the BTO support these projects as they are providing information that will highlight the problems that these birds face when they leave the comparative! safety of the UK. Freddy, I don't see you as a poor misguided birder but I do know that you will do everything in your power to maintain and increase the numbers of all birds but particularly migrant species. In a lot of birders eyes a ring, colour ring, wing tag or radio antennae is not aestheticly pleasing as well as denying the lister a tick. If it's going to enhance our knowledge to prevent what are now relatively common species from becoming critically endangered or even extinct, then I'm all for it and I would think you are too!
Yours, not so eloquently,
Stuart

Stuart,
In your capacity as an experienced bird ringer I can see quite clearly where you are coming from, as they say, arriving hotfoot and not unexpectedly on the scene with comments on my post in defence of the ethics and activities of the ringing/tracking fraternity. However, I have one or two comments on your comments.

First, you casually gloss over the disfiguring aspect and the basic question of the aesthetics of wing-tagging, merely stating that it is done so that individual birds may be identified in the field and to enhance our knowledge. My post presciently pre-empted those points, as you will see if you re-read it, and clearly stressed the disfiguring of the wing-tagged bird.

Further, your post completely fails to mention the vital question of comparative numerical degree involved regarding ringing, wing-tagging and this year's Osprey/Cuckoo tracking, and it is precisely that question of numerical degree that intrigues and worries me. With this year's Osprey/Cuckoo tagging and tracking we are only talking about a handful of birds of the two species handled with expert care and scientific know-how. On the other hand, with Birds of Prey wing-tagging we are talking about hundreds of birds to date being tagged 'in the field' in a variety of conditions. In addition, with ringing, we are talking about millions of birds ringed to date.

I suspect that the actual ringing recovery figures of, say, migrants outside the UK amount to a very small percentage indeed, almost certainly much less than 1%. While I respect ringers for all the sterling work they have accomplished over the years and I can but admire their skill, dedication and commitment, and clearly there are certain current aspects of their work which are wholly beneficial, on the other hand there are elements of it which leave me uncomfortable and perturbed. I just can't get my head around why, for example, it's not uncommon for a ringing group to ring, say, 500 Swallows and 700 House Martins in a single summer when perhaps only a couple, one or even none of those birds will ever be monitored again outside the UK.....and the ringers themselves are fully aware of that likely result.

Further, it's an historical fact that the first British ringed Swallow was recovered in Natal, South Africa in December 1912. If we already knew through ringing almost one hundred years ago that they wintered as far south as South Africa, why have we subsequently continued to ring tens/hundreds of thousands of other Swallows since 1912 to prove that Swallows winter as far south as South Africa ?.....and knowing full well that the details of only an infinitesimal number of birds will ever be recovered. Surely we don't still need to continue ringing very large numbers annually to confirm how long Swallows live or that they return to their native barn every year or that they stop off en route to and from South Africa ? Is there not an element of repetitive and indulgent self-delusion involved there, or perhaps an undue fascination with ringing totals on occasion ? Or is there some VITAL additional, other than minor, point I am failing to grasp, rather than it really being a question of the infinitesimally small chance of gathering peripheral information for the sake of the infinitesimally small chance of gathering peripheral information ?

But we digress from wing-tagging.....you really should not have raised the subject of ringing, Stuart.

Some of my best friends and respected acquaintances are ringers and they are adult enough to sigh and recognise my 'different' views and to acknowledge that not everyone agrees with the current systems of ringing and wing-tagging. They are also adult enough to patiently and earnestly argue their corner as part of a healthy debate/discussion with this (repeatedly) 'poor misguided birder'. Perhaps I need a Road to Damascus conversion on this matter, but who will convert me and with what pearls of wisdom ?

Finally, I proffer one ( misguided ? ) prediction. Perhaps the time will arrive in the not too distant future when the whole question of bird ringing/tracking will undergo a re-evaluation. With rapidly evolving new high quality technology handled by full-time professionals, the activity will become more cost, time and labour effective and could well pass eventually into the sole hands of scientific institutions staffed by full-time professionals with recognised outstations at the bird observatories.......with endless leg-iron fitting and wing-tagging becoming things of the past or mere shadows of their former selves.

Meanwhile, wing-tagging seems set to continue and increase, while (cannon/mistnetting techniques apart), the vast majority of ringers will for whatever reason soldier on with much the same technology they have used for the last hundred years......since in fact, that first British ringed Swallow was recovered in Natal, South Africa in December 1912.

Freddy

Freddy,
I have responded by private message as we are poles apart on this subject and are likely to remain so.

Stuart and I have exchanged pms. I believe that although we differ strongly on the subject, we depart in mutual respect and peace.

I, for one, would now be quite happy to put the subject of wing-tagging to bed.

Freddy

Hi Freddie

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Some like you find an unsullied wing beautiful, others find the idea that the wing tag is contributing to the conservation of that species equally beautiful. I have to say that I am in that camp with Stuart. Who is to say who is right but I admire that you can agree to differ in mutual respect and peace.

On the subject of Red Kites, there are those who find the idea abhorrent that any bird wing tagged or not, has had human assistance to be reintroduced. I don't agree with that degree of purism either. Its just a fact of life that humans interfere with nature and nothing is likely to change that, in the next few hundred years at least.

.....Phil,
As they say, that's fair comment.

Freddy