The Lincolnshire Bird Club

Thanks for that Katherine. "Text-speak" is something that I hadn't considered but then I am probably getting a bit old for such modern things. Come to think of it I am probably getting a bit too old for the game of "Bonxie" as you see it being played - but then we are beginning to deviate from the subject of bird watching! It seems to me that "Sparrowhawk" is a perfectly good name for a hawk which preys on sparrows so why change it to some meaningless nonsense word like "Sprawk". Similarly "Meadow Pipit" seems like a splendid name for a pipit that frequents meadows so why invent a silly word like "mipit" which carries no meaning? If the inventors of this mystery "language" continue to invent new words for birds by chopping out most of the middle letters of the name they should soon find that, for example, "Wood pigeon" becomes "Wigeon" and "Dunnock" becomes "Duck". Maybe at that point they will consider what a pointless exercise this "bird-speak" is and revert to using the standard names which everyone can recognise and understand. Let's not forget that we are on the world wide web here and this is not just the "inner circle" of the LBC. Though there are some who doubtless consider this "trashing" of bird names rather clever there must be many reading these pages who wonder what the devil they are on about!

At the risk of pushing this discussion over the edge, you may want to check out http://www.tha-engliscan-gesithas.org.u ... stsrc.html . This lists many old English names for English birds, which, if you think about it, were probably in use for much longer than our modern names. Spearhafoc for instance, is the old name for Sparrowhawk. Meadow Pipits are actually found in far more wide ranging habitats than meadows (as defined by http://www.tha-engliscan-gesithas.org.u ... stsrc.html) and are most common in upland areas. Although round here saltmarsh is the habitat of choice. Dunnocks used to be called Hedge Sparrow, and way before that they were Hægsugga, which does actually sound a little like Hedge Sparrow if you say it aloud. Plus the fact that the Dunnock is actually an Accentor, and should really be called Hedge Accentor. Its all rather confusing, and far from stable.

All that aside, i don't think anyone has actually used these abbrieviations (mippit etc) of bird names on the forum have they? All this seems to have been triggered by Roy asking about Bonxies, which is a very widespread and well understood name by birders. Clearly not by everyone, but most people would just ask, learn and then add it to their reportoir. To keep going on about elitism is just plain daft. If i really wanted to be elitist, i would say that Freddy was talking about SH, MP, PK and BA. And thats about as elitist as birders can get!

In Finland they actually use a shortened version of the scientific name as a "birders speak". The only one i can remember is "Pro" for Pallas' Warbler. So its not just us Brits who do it!

Words also appear rather quickly in the dictionary these days. For example, "chav" (deregatory slang meaning those with money and no taste apparently...) is a word that has, as far as i'm aware, only been around for a few short years, but is already enjoying its own entry in the Chambers dictionary, and i suspect the great OED as well. Who knows what bird names will turn into over the coming few years. The Collin's Bird Guide took it upon itself to introduce a couple of new names, and no doubt to anyone who has never known any different, they will become the standard names.

Birding is meant to be fun, and for me part of that fun is the learning process. I don't particularly care for the taxonomists wrestling over whether a specific name should be masculine or feminine, and it irks me a little bit if they change something from montana to montanus after years of usage just to be grammaticaly correct in Ancient Greek (!), but these things happen, and we might as well learn from it.

Just to add to the discussion, there several precedents for not using standard English when recording birds. Ringers in the UK use a five letter code on all species when submitting records. Therefore Great Spotted Woodpecker becomes GRSWO, Dunnock is DUNNO, Blackbird is BLABI etc. etc. Having ringed in Europe with ringers who don't speak English, the Latin name is always used to avoid confusion. It all just helps to broaden one's knowledge rather than a case of one-upmanship.

Thanks Stuart. All I really wanted to know was why we we had the introduction of names like "Sprawk" and "Mipit" when there were perfectly good common names in general use. If I were to go round to my neighbours, who are keen birdwatchers, and say "I've just seen a sprawk eating a mipit" they would probably instigate proceedings to have me removed to the home for the bewildered. I too thought that birding should be fun and that armed with a few decent guides showing English and Latin names I would be able to understand something about it. Now it seems that to have an inkling of what is going on I need to learn the dialect of the Shetland Islands, study Olde English, learn Latin, get a grasp of a few Scandivanian languages, learn the codes of bird ringers in various languages and so on and so on. Doesn't seem like a lot of fun to me - maybe I should look for a hobby more suited to my simple mind! (Did the people who invented "Sprawk" and "Mipit" etc really have an understanding of all these different languages?). Save me a place in the home for the bewildered.

Sent to me by Trevor Lee
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Trevor,

You really are missing the point here, 'Bonxie' as has already been pointed out is the name given to Great Skuas in the Shetland isles, it has merely been accepted by birders throughout the UK as an affectionate term for them, it is far from elitist and far from new ! I have been birding for 32 years now and they have always been Bonxie to me.

To compare it with mipit and sprawk is perhaps a little naive as these terms are just slang and very modern.

Enjoy your birding and get out and see some Bonxies ! they are great !

regards

Trev

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Andrew Chick
Website: http://www.forktail.co.uk/

Trevor,
You've mentioned your advancing years but for heaven's sake don't give senility a bad name! By now, you should realise that embracing any new hobby goes hand-in-hand with learning the in-speak. As someone who has plunged into computers and computer-speak since turning 70, and has also attempted in the last 5 years since then to master the rudiments of Portuguese and Serbian (INCLUDING the names of a few common birds) - the more to enjoy holidays in Madeira and Montenegro respectively AND come to grips with some new birding terms, I speak from experience. Your recent posts read as if they were written by someone who is tired of life, not by someone tired of the challenge of picking up snippets about your new hobby. If you were to learn a new language as a hobby, would you whinge about all the 'bewildering' new words you came across?
Several of us have tried to point you in the right direction, but as far as I'm concerned, my patience is exhausted.

Freddy

Freddy

I admire your ability to learn new things at your advanced age but you are not the only one - I've even built my own computer from scratch since passing the magic 70! I am quite happy to learn about birds (and many other new things) and there is plenty to learn eg how to identify them, where to find them, their behaviour, and their proper names etc. What I don't see the point of here is needing to learn silly or slang names the only purpose of which, as far as I can see, is to identify oneself as a member of a clique. I have spent many years in Yorkshire where it is said that people call a spade a spade and so have learned to have more respect for somone who calls a Sparrowhawk a Sparrowhawk than someone who has to invent a nonsensical name for the same bird. My patience is exhausted too which is why I am pleased that I will not be member of this Club for much longer!

Trevor

Trevor Lee

I think that I did say that after some research I could see why "Bonxie" was used and could appreciate that it made sense in conversation amongst those who watch sea birds. Those of us who spend most of our time watching inland birds (or should that be birds inland?) are unlikely to have come across the word and it was a mystery to me when it first appeared on this page.

The use of the words "Sprawk" etc came up later and I still fail to understand why there is any need to invent such nonsense rather than use accepted names.

I intend to continue enjoying my birdwatching though I will be even more surprised if any "Bonxies" appear round here!

Trevor